Ultimate Footy

Feline wrote:Whinge alert!

Switching the RFA 1 to RFA 8 is bullshit! We had pick 1 and 16, so already been penalised for 1st pick (and in the case of the early picks heavily)

In essence you are giving RFA 8 a triple pick when they are already on a even level! Random reselection might be OK. Reversing the order = giving RFA 8 an unfair advantage!

The random selection already happened at the start though so kind of superfluous.

You also got pick 17...

In a perfectly fair draft of 8 players, there would be X number of top level players, divisible by the number of draftees (eg, 8/16/24) and everyone gets the same number of top level players. This is obviously a perfect world scenario and would never actually happen - nobody has any hangups about that. Look at the top 16 players;

Code:

C. Smith MEL - HOK  69
J. Friend SYD - HOK 58.5
A. Fifita CRO - FRF 58.3
R. James GC - FRF,2RF 57.5
M. Pearce SYD - HLF  56.5
Mannering WAR - 2RF 56.5
T. Merrin PEN - 2RF 55.7
P. Gallen CRO - 2RF 55.2
A. Reynolds SOU - HLF 54.6
N. Cleary PEN - HLF 54.5
De Belin STI - FRF,2RF 54.2
J. Graham CBY - FRF 54.1
B. Cordner SYD - 2RF 53.5
Burgess SOU - FRF,2RF 53.3
Thompson WAR - 2RF 52.9
DCE     MAN - HLF 52.2

1st pick gets the only top tier player and has a massive advantage over the rest of the field, who are all reasonably even.

Not that I'm claiming the draft style is/was unfair, or are spitting chips about picking towards the end of the draft. I'll still beat all ya'll from back there. Besides, drafts aren't won and lost in the first round - its in the players you get in late rounds who over perform.

ryno_ wrote: I'll still beat all ya'll from back there.

No you won't.

Quick question, does your bench players count towards your score or is it just the starting 13.  if not what are the emergencies for then?

Thanks and sorry for the rookie question, never played this format before.

wolfking wrote:Quick question, does your bench players count towards your score or is it just the starting 13.  if not what are the emergencies for then?

Thanks and sorry for the rookie question, never played this format before.

AE players only count toward your score if one of your starting 13 is a late withdrawal or does not line up whatsoever. If they play for 30 seconds and get injured then you won't get an AE.

AE players are there in case of a late withdrawal.

Bren wrote:

AE players only count toward your score if one of your starting 13 is a late withdrawal or does not line up whatsoever. If they play for 30 seconds and get injured then you won't get an AE.

AE players are there in case of a late withdrawal.

Cheers mate, just like fantasy then.

wolfking wrote:

Cheers mate, just like fantasy then.

Unlike fantasy though in that if a WFB doesn't play, he can only be replaced by the WFB emergency.

Even if your CTR emergency has WFB DPP eligibility, he won't come into play unless he is actually named in the WFB emergency slot

ryno_ wrote:

You also got pick 17...

In a perfectly fair draft of 8 players, there would be X number of top level players, divisible by the number of draftees (eg, 8/16/24) and everyone gets the same number of top level players. This is obviously a perfect world scenario and would never actually happen - nobody has any hangups about that. Look at the top 16 players;

Code:

C. Smith MEL - HOK  69
J. Friend SYD - HOK 58.5
A. Fifita CRO - FRF 58.3
R. James GC - FRF,2RF 57.5
M. Pearce SYD - HLF  56.5
Mannering WAR - 2RF 56.5
T. Merrin PEN - 2RF 55.7
P. Gallen CRO - 2RF 55.2
A. Reynolds SOU - HLF 54.6
N. Cleary PEN - HLF 54.5
De Belin STI - FRF,2RF 54.2
J. Graham CBY - FRF 54.1
B. Cordner SYD - 2RF 53.5
Burgess SOU - FRF,2RF 53.3
Thompson WAR - 2RF 52.9
DCE     MAN - HLF 52.2

1st pick gets the only top tier player and has a massive advantage over the rest of the field, who are all reasonably even.

Not that I'm claiming the draft style is/was unfair, or are spitting chips about picking towards the end of the draft. I'll still beat all ya'll from back there. Besides, drafts aren't won and lost in the first round - its in the players you get in late rounds who over perform.

and then pick 32.

Point the draft is about more than 1 player. There is no guarantee the player will perform as well this year, or not get injured in Round and sit out the season

What is proposed is akin to a referee saying, you one the toss, and got the advantage of the wind in the first half, so I am going to go harder on you with penalties. Even though the 2nd half it flips around. As it exists, the draft is designed fairly. Where do you stop changing the design? and Who gets to decide? If this were 'the rules', then they should have been explained at the start.

Feline wrote:

and then pick 32.

Point the draft is about more than 1 player. There is no guarantee the player will perform as well this year, or not get injured in Round and sit out the season

What is proposed is akin to a referee saying, you one the toss, and got the advantage of the wind in the first half, so I am going to go harder on you with penalties. Even though the 2nd half it flips around. As it exists, the draft is designed fairly. Where do you stop changing the design? and Who gets to decide? If this were 'the rules', then they should have been explained at the start.

99.9% certain that every single year we have played Ultimate the person who had the #1 draft pick was position #8 RFA when the season kicked off. (That is the settings in L1, L2 and L3 also). Obviously if someone above you picks up a player you then move into #7, you don't stay at #8 all season - it is a rolling RFA order. You picked up the #1 player who averages 10 points more then the next player in the entire League.

If anyone has something to bitch about it is the person who was #8 in the draft order. They get picks #8 and #9 then have to wait ages until they get another double pick. I don't see quicksand complaining, especially when IIRC he has been pick #8 two years in a row.

Righto, how do I bring in RTS from my emergencies to replace Nona?

Also, Daifiti for Hoare and Friend for Farah? And wtf am I doing with bodene as an emergency

Rabbit wrote:Righto, how do I bring in RTS from my emergencies to replace Nona?

Also, Daifiti for Hoare and Friend for Farah? And wtf am I doing with bodene as an emergency

Click on the WFB button next to Nona. All other eligible WFB players should be highlighted then just click on the player you want to transfer into your squad.

Daifiti + Friend > Hoare and Farah.

Feline wrote:

and then pick 32.

Point the draft is about more than 1 player. There is no guarantee the player will perform as well this year, or not get injured in Round and sit out the season

What is proposed is akin to a referee saying, you one the toss, and got the advantage of the wind in the first half, so I am going to go harder on you with penalties. Even though the 2nd half it flips around. As it exists, the draft is designed fairly. Where do you stop changing the design? and Who gets to decide? If this were 'the rules', then they should have been explained at the start.

You are terrible at analogies.

Bren wrote:If anyone has something to bitch about it is the person who was #8 in the draft order. They get picks #8 and #9 then have to wait ages until they get another double pick. I don't see quicksand complaining, especially when IIRC he has been pick #8 two years in a row.

Swings and roundabouts. Id put #8 as the 3rd best draft position (after 1 & 2).

Feline wrote:

and then pick 32.

Point the draft is about more than 1 player. There is no guarantee the player will perform as well this year, or not get injured in Round and sit out the season

What is proposed is akin to a referee saying, you one the toss, and got the advantage of the wind in the first half, so I am going to go harder on you with penalties. Even though the 2nd half it flips around. As it exists, the draft is designed fairly. Where do you stop changing the design? and Who gets to decide? If this were 'the rules', then they should have been explained at the start.

Per 2016 averages, Pick 1 in R1 is about 14 points better off than Pick 8 in R1.  
For following rounds, the difference between first and last picks is 1-3 points assuming you pick the potentially highest scorer possible.

Seems to me there is a significant average points advantage in the first round, picking 1st in the draft rather than 8th - and the difference is difficult to make up in following rounds - even if Pick 8 instead targets higher tier players in low scoring positions where quality also drops off quickly.

If there were 21 rounds instead of 22, Person picking last in R1 would pick last in R21, and would get RFA Rank 1 by default, and there would be no issues.   So, your justification seems to focus entirely on R22 - because Overall Pick 1 picked last in R22, he should also get RFA Rank 1 - ignoring the significant advantage of overall first pick.

Pick 1 has the first opportunity to make the best scoring team.  Pick 8 has the last opportunity to make the best scoring team (by picking last in R1 and R13 as only 13 players count for scoring).  

Seems only fair that Pick 8 should have the first opportunity to make his team better on the waiver wire.

Russ wrote:



Per 2016 averages, Pick 1 in R1 is about 14 points better off than Pick 8 in R1.  
For following rounds, the difference between first and last picks is 1-3 points assuming you pick the potentially highest scorer possible.

Seems to me there is a significant average points advantage in the first round, picking 1st in the draft rather than 8th - and the difference is difficult to make up in following rounds - even if Pick 8 instead targets higher tier players in low scoring positions where quality also drops off quickly.

If there were 21 rounds instead of 22, Person picking last in R1 would pick last in R21, and would get RFA Rank 1 by default, and there would be no issues.   So, your justification seems to focus entirely on R22 - because Overall Pick 1 picked last in R22, he should also get RFA Rank 1 - ignoring the significant advantage of overall first pick.

Pick 1 has the first opportunity to make the best scoring team.  Pick 8 has the last opportunity to make the best scoring team (by picking last in R1 and R13 as only 13 players count for scoring).  

Seems only fair that Pick 8 should have the first opportunity to make his team better on the waiver wire.

Agreed. In any event it is just the initial ranking. In this comp, does the wire ranking reset each week based on the ladder?

RFA positions change all year.

Sauce Reed wrote:RFA positions change all year.

based on the ladder? or do you only go to the back of the queue if you've made a successful wire claim?

Waiver authority overrated anyway unless you are on the site several times a day.  Players son't spend much time on the restricted list before becoming available. So most of the signings made are from free agency.

Jarryd Hayne in particular last year was on the system for less than 24 hours before being signed.

For what its worth, my team after the L3 draft. Solid, but not amazing I would say. I found myself scrambling to pick up decent HOK, HLF, WFB options once others had taken the top picks, which then left me struggling a bit to fill out my forward pack.

With draft picks, especially high ones, being so valuable, I can imagine injuries play a pretty big role in this comp, as an injury (or suspension) to a gun hurts only one team (starting to second-guess my selections of Josh Dugan and Paul Gallen...).

Dugan, SKD, Goodwin
Aitken, Aubusson
Johnson, Sutton
James, Tolman
Lichaa
Gallen, ET, Thompson

Res: Wighton, Gordon, Glenn, Townsend, McCrone, Wallace, Mannah, Ballin, N.Brown

Russ wrote:



Per 2016 averages, Pick 1 in R1 is about 14 points better off than Pick 8 in R1.  
For following rounds, the difference between first and last picks is 1-3 points assuming you pick the potentially highest scorer possible.

Seems to me there is a significant average points advantage in the first round, picking 1st in the draft rather than 8th - and the difference is difficult to make up in following rounds - even if Pick 8 instead targets higher tier players in low scoring positions where quality also drops off quickly.

If there were 21 rounds instead of 22, Person picking last in R1 would pick last in R21, and would get RFA Rank 1 by default, and there would be no issues.   So, your justification seems to focus entirely on R22 - because Overall Pick 1 picked last in R22, he should also get RFA Rank 1 - ignoring the significant advantage of overall first pick.

Pick 1 has the first opportunity to make the best scoring team.  Pick 8 has the last opportunity to make the best scoring team (by picking last in R1 and R13 as only 13 players count for scoring).  

Seems only fair that Pick 8 should have the first opportunity to make his team better on the waiver wire.

OK.. Maybe I have jumped the gun. Still seems a silly way to resolve it.

If the leagues rotate from year to year, why not do like they set the people who were relegated to RFA #1, promoted to RFA# 8, and everyone else based on their reverse relative position from the year before. Person who came 1st gets RFA #7, person who came 7th (not relegated) gets RFA #2. Newcomers start at the bottom.

From what you are saying there is no real difference between picks #2 through #8, and furthermore pick #1 could be injured etc at any time. Anyway I am really unsure about for the RFAs and FAs work in any case