NRL Fantasy 2018 Thread Part 38

Moose wrote:
If the Broncos lost the game there wouldn't be so much discussion over such a minor incident. Salty vaginas everywhere this morning.

Broncos fans wonder why everyone hates their team...

Milchcow wrote:

Krump pasted the rules recently. Here are the rules definitions

KNOCK-ON means to knock the ball forward towards the opponents’
dead ball line with hand or arm while playing at the ball.

FORWARD PASS is a throw towards the opponents’ dead ball line (see
Section 10).

Relevant part of Section 10

Direction of Pass 1. The direction of a pass is relative to the player making it and
not to the actual path relative to the ground. A player running
towards his opponents’ goal line may throw the ball towards
a colleague who is behind him but because of the thrower’s
own momentum the ball travels forward relative to the
ground. This is not a forward pass as the thrower has not
passed the ball forward in relation to himself. This is
particularly noticeable when a running player makes a high,
lobbed pass


There is a side note explaining that forward passes are subject to the momentum of the player. there is no such note for knock ons.

Yup, that's what I said earlier. I personally think the rules are not well written and given a situation such as last night can occur, the rules should explicitly state one way or another where the reference point is for knock ons. Like i said in my previous post, I think the reason its not explicitly stats is because one it is a rare occurrence where a definitions is required while the other happens all the time.

If we take it that in the absence of a "Direction of knock-on 1" note, the reference point for knock-ons is the ground (not the player), then if you take it to the extreme, a player can legally bat the ball forward, so long as the ball goes backward relative to the ground. It's plausible this could happen at any point in the game if a player is running toward his own goal line in an attempt to get to the ball.

If that's the case then surely it highlights a change in rule is required..... and probably also why refs enforce the rule differently to how we are interpreting it. I.e. knock ons are called all the time when the ball goes forward off the player but backward relative to the ground!

Food for thought!

Milchcow wrote:

Isaako's right hand is neither the ground, nor an opponent. So the movement of the ball before hitting it is irrelevant.

Yup, sadly this is where you argument comes unstuck Loomer.

Moose wrote:
If the Broncos lost the game there wouldn't be so much discussion over such a minor incident. Salty vaginas everywhere this morning.

Strange thing to say, but moving on from that, IMO the discussion would be the same, on this forum at least, because the whole discussion is around the rule. 9/10 people it seem, aren't bothered either way by the result but are just discussing what the actual rule is and how it should deb interpreted.

Time to get discussion onto a much less controversial topic. If I pool hop Martin using Dugan does that make me a wretched villain, just realised I can do it?

Tell me where it says it ok to propel ball from trailing arm to leading arm and hit the ground and not be knock on because that's at least half the accidentals this season wrong

https://streamable.com/ylw7l

Anyone that owns Dugan might aswell cheat the points into their 17, need all the help they can get after making such a dud trade

Loomer wrote:As in the photos I posted or video close up of him catching of you want to find it he propels the ball towards opposition goal with his left palm into his right wrist

lol.. you can't knock the ball on into your own hand...

filthridden wrote:Are we going to make it to three pages of discussion on knock-on rulings or can we move on?

These are the following topics we can discuess, and the times when we can discuss them

Monday to Thursday - should I trade in this player that everyone else is also trading in

Thursday night to Sunday - Choice of - I'm missing TBs. The refs are hopeless. I have scored 570 from 3 players, is this good for the week? Random abuse of fellow posters

Chewie wrote:

knock-on:

Clearly backwards

Krump wrote:Time to get discussion onto a much less controversial topic. If I pool hop Martin using Dugan does that make me a wretched villain, just realised I can do it?

Depends which thread you talk about it in.

Krump wrote:Time to get discussion onto a much less controversial topic. If I pool hop Martin using Dugan does that make me a wretched villain, just realised I can do it?

Who for?

Milchcow wrote:

Depends which thread you talk about it in.

Ughh, Ashley Klein tonight.

mulvy wrote:

Who for?

Murray.

Loomer wrote:Tell me where it says it ok to propel ball from trailing arm to leading arm and hit the ground and not be knock on because that's at least half the accidentals this season wrong

https://streamable.com/ylw7l

It's last point of contact that matters, in a hypothetical scenario where a player running forwards and towards the sideline is bobbling the ball, realizes he won't regather in time to stay in field and just knocks the ball clearly backwards back into the field of play, it would never be called a knock-on

I just can't decide which is more exciting. Bad calls or owed stats  

I'm just gonna say my piece and leave it at that.  

Agree that there are heaps of terrible calls every week. Some worse than others and it doesn't matter if it goes upstairs or not most of the time. Just as quick examples. Slaters drop kick try, Nenes finger control try vs the chooks (video), Sutton got a forward pass last week. Some calls affect the flow of the game horrendously and some don't end up mattering. There's way too many like this in the last 3 rds that I just move on and go to the next week. Refs make calls at full speed to the best of their ability. They aren't paid well enough to do anything more. Don't like that? Then get ready for slow penalty filled games where we get overcalls from the bunker, every play is reviewable and the rules don't have any common sense because computerised robot refs need specific conditions to ref the game but we get perfect decisions. Try applying common sense? Refs don't have anything hard or fast to go on and the grey area of a refs call is complained about as we do now.

Part of sport for me has always been about managing the very human refs and the bulldogs were hopeless at it last night. I've reffed before (scoially mind you) and its a bloody rough job. I'm certainly not counting the penalties or anything I'm just trying to keep the game flowing and doing the best job I can in accordance with the rules.

Mbye was just lazy to not try and take the kick on the full and didn't trust his teammate to prevent the try so he doubled down and pushed a player sideways in the back at full pace. Regardless of the force - which we can't judge from a TV viewpoint - we still get a full speed contested putdown where the bulldogs player knocked the ball dead to prevent Darius having a shot to win the game. 100% I give a penalty (probably went upstairs to have a second look and see if he could have been wrong - didn't want to give away a match ending penalty and have video find him wrong)

Klemmer was dudded by Pay (swapping captains is never great - it's not up to the refs to watch this) and likely given a 2nd chance may have approached the situation differently. I've never known telling the ref he's rubbish or that his calls are bad to be very effective. Maybe next time he will start with "Sir, I'm here as the captain while Josh is off. Can you explain to me why it feels like we are getting penalised when Brisbane isn't for similar offences? etc..........

Did it change the result? I don't think so. The broncos still had a chance for a field goal at the end so lets say the odds were not in the dogs favour. Even if they hold that out its a 50/50 at best.
Did they deserve to win? Probably not. The bulldogs were hardly the better team. They got two tries from Broncos backs being unable to pickup a loose ball. They took the most of those chances but if they were dominating generally they would have run up a score to the point this stuff wouldn't have mattered.
Is it a shite way to lose? You bet. I'd be filthy at Mbye after busting my guts and having him put the decision in the refs hands like that.

Cheers lads,



  Broncs fan